Areopagus and an Unknown God
Following on from Josh’s post on Mars Hill:
What almost none of you know is that I am an evangelical Christian. I have been a member of what can best be described as a theologically conservative but social justice minded church in this city for almost ten years now. I’m not a rubber-stamping Bush-lovin’ God and GOP sort of Christian in any way, but I will say that I believe fervently in Jesus Christ enough to make some people in this town cringe. I also grew up in Tulsa, a land of televangelists, fire-breathing Bible bangers, and 90% church attendance.
And now that I have given my street cred to the Jesus freaks and turned off all the atheists, let me say this:
Mars Hill makes me want to hurl.
Once upon a time, a number of years ago, I got an invite in the mail to come check out a new church startup founded by a guy named Mark Driscoll. I didn’t ever follow up. Heck, I’ve never darkened the door of that place to this day. But the four-color mailer was talking about some interesting ideas. Truth. Beauty. Trying to use culture to understand Christianity.
Years on, though, I’ve wondered if they’ve ever fulfilled that vision. The first big local article on Mars Hill, though, really just made me wince:
Well into an hour-long gospel class, Pastor Mark Driscoll still holds his audience in rapt attention…. Now he’s giving his highly opinionated take on which of the many versions of the Bible are good.
He draws a chart: On the left he lists Bibles he says are translated word-for-word (good). On the right, those that use more metaphorical or creative language (not so good). He also ranks the Bibles vertically, putting on top those he thinks highly of (New International Version, the one he uses; New American Standard; New King James). Far to the right, and way down on the bottom — “toward hell,” he says — comes the New Revised Standard Version. The widely used New Revised, which distinguishes between references to all humans and references to men and women separately, is “the politically correct Bible,” he says. “It’s like the Bible got neutered.”
Our church had just bought new Bibles, ones we felt best handled the translation from the Greek and Hebrew and were the most accurate and literal. Take one guess which version we decided on. Yup. The one “toward hell.” Because, you see, in Driscoll’s world, despite our evangelical Biblical beliefs and our history of growth and mission work, we’re hell-bound because we are using the wrong translation.
And then, I started hearing the stories. The ones about wives being effectively told that in order to submit to their husbands they had to stay home with the kids, rejecting whatever career or life they had. And the thing was, I was hearing these stories from all sides. And it sounded like the place was becoming a marriage factory, too. The last thing a church should be doing is pushing people into marriage. They were a ways away from Sun-Yung Moon, but still, it’s one thing to model good marriages; it’s another to effectively make your place one giant marriage incubator.
And Driscoll’s got a mouth on him. I’m surprised he’s able to be understood considering how often he puts his foot in it. Just for example, he got into it with a writer for Leadership Journal, a magazine for pastors from Christianity Today (the house organ for evangelical Christianity in America). (Admittedly, unless you have some understanding of the internal debates in the church right now, this bit will sale over your head.) Driscoll later got called on the carpet and apologized for being an idiot.
The whole thing worries me. It’s one thing to say that a Christian and non-Christian will never share the sort of connection spiritually that two Christians would, but this bit in the Salon article is cringeworthy:
[Dietz] pauses and sets down his coffee cup in a motion that is about to put a definitive end to a delightful evening. “Listen,” he says. “We have a really nice rapport. But we believe different things. And let’s face it, because of that, you’re never going to feel like family to me. So, what I’m saying is, this is as far as it goes.” Stung at first, upon reflection I can’t blame him. I have nothing like his shared faith to connect me to other people.
It’s exclusive. It’s uninviting. It really just pisses me off. Instead of “we have this wonderful relationship, and you can have it too,” it’s “we have this wonderful relationship, and if you don’t get it, you don’t get it.” It sounds vaguely cultish.
Now, I will admit, again, I’ve never been to Mars Hill. I also know that many of the reports in the media don’t “get religion,” so a lot of these articles about religious groups betray the ignorance — or the biases — of the reporters. But all that said, I’m not sure I like what I’m reading. It seems like Mars Hill isn’t engaging culture as much as being voyeurs of it, all while disconnecting from the world. Through the real estate holdings of its members, they’re popping up in neighborhoods, but it doesn’t sound like they’re really engaging with those neighborhoods. And as for women, it sounds like “wives, submit to your husbands” is ten times more important than “husbands, love your wives.”
And it all sounds… cultish. I can’t put my finger on why, but it reminds me of a group we had on my college campus years ago that was a certified cult. I’m not calling them a cult, though. It just concerns me.
I’d like to write a 5000 word post on the religious history of Seattle, why Seattle has never had a high amount of church attendance, and why the most successful Christian institutions in this town have generally been conservative. I won’t bore you with that, but suffice to say that Mars Hill is filling a hole in this city spiritually. What I wonder is whether in doing so they’re serving Jesus, or they’re serving a social structure with Jesus’ name plastered on it.
Jesus said that people would hate those who followed him. But sometimes, you wonder, in all the cacophony, if the believers of Mars Hill are too busy stuffing wax in their ears to hear the few and good quietly telling them to make sure they’re listening to God and not being hard-headed and priggish.
*muse*
You know, I suppose his comments are cringeworthy and uninviting, but in a way, as someone who is not evangelical Christian, I appreciate it. I was married into a fundamentalist, evangelical family for a long time, and they never went that route - they never went the exclusive attitude.
They went the other way, which has too often been my experience - I was invited, repeatedly, and my beliefs continually attacked. It wore me down, after a while - not swaying me to the beliefs they held, but just underscoring my desire to have nothing to do with them.
Evangelical/fundamental Christianity is an exclusive thing. I don’t think that automagically means rude and hostile, but as a willful outsider, I do appreciate it when someone on the other side of the fence realizes and acknowledges the differences and leaves it at that.
And that’s the thing, you know? There’s exclusivity, but being an ass about it makes all Christians look bad. Of course, Robertson and Falwell have been doing a good job of that already….
Nicely put.
Hey Dylan!
You should come check out Mars Hill so you can see it for yourself instead of through the eyes of the media.
alright…here’s what gets me:
christians get married and the ladies choose (note the word “choose”) to either continue with their successful careers and raise children OR decide to stay home and care for their children. for the latter, they are ridiculed, judged, even damned by both fellow christians and those who are not christians. they are accused of being extremists/fundementalists as well as being “forced” into these decisions by their husbands. but…BUT…
….i don’t see anyone bashing on those who are not christians but choosing to the do the same thing. no one’s bashing on my friend who’s an agnostic who gave up a highly prominient/successful career as a designer to move out of the city, purchase land on vashon, have a child and choose (note that word again) to become a full-time homemaker. anyone bashing her or others like her? of course not. why? because you put the words “christian” and “homemaker” together and everyone freaks out, grabs their stones, and starts chucking it at the first man/woman who comes along and is open with their choice (oh…there’s that word again) to “give it all up” for their family.
for the record: i’ve had a very successful life, am about to get married, will continue my career, and look forward to raising children. when i begin having children, i can’t wait to become a stay-at-home mom. why? because my mother was one and as a child i remember how wonderful it was. i can’t wait to start making baby food that is preservative free and a healthy alternative for my child. i can’t wait to be there when the little hallmarks like the first step/first word happens. but these are personal choices (oh that word) that i am making on my own as a highly educated, professional, independent, strong woman.
in other words, careful with your generalizations AND please look at all sides of the story before you start judging and accusing a lifestyle that many (christian or not) have been embracing for the centuries.
hi. it’s me again. i forgot something:
1. i’m a christian
2. i’m a liberal
3. everything you say regarding mars hill is heresay until you (YOU…not an article) actually find out for yourself (YOU) what’s really going on via some form of research (stopping by, talking with us, etc)
4. i’m very engaged in culture (many of my friends are not christians, almost every night/weekend i’m catching shows, films, readings, etc., i don’t do “churchy” things, i’m a freelance writer doing rock culture pieces, am quite fluent in city/state/national/world politics/events/thoughts, belong to a moped gang, etc.)
6. i’ve been living in ballard for over 3 years
7. i have first-hand experience with cults and can tell you that mars hill is sooo not a cult.
8. my fiance has never ever told me that i must now stay home. it is a decision i chose that he embraces and is grateful for.
9. the men at mars hill are constantly being hammered for “men, love your wives.” this includes my fiance.
10. if mars hill is a marriage factory, then what do you call all the couples meeting and getting married outside of mars hill who are or are not christians? i mean…people have been getting married for centuries.
everything you say regarding mars hill is heresay until you (YOU…not an article) actually find out for yourself
Why? Why do I have to see Mars Hill in action for myself? Why can’t I take it on faith that the DOZENS OF REPORTS WRITTEN BY DOZENS OF REPORTERS ALL SAYING THE SAME THING are more accurate than inaccurate?
i’m a liberal
Good for you! Your own church’s Website says “We are not liberals,” though.
mars hill is sooo not a cult
Well, golly! That’s all the proof I need!
“Why? Why do I have to see Mars Hill in action for myself? Why can’t I take it on faith that the DOZENS OF REPORTS WRITTEN BY DOZENS OF REPORTERS ALL SAYING THE SAME THING are more accurate than inaccurate?”
Wow that’s awesome, Adam.
Correct me if I’m wrong but did you just use a “it’s gotta be true because I read on salon.com” kind of argument? If there are really a dozen..could you email them to me?
Go once.
Go to the church once. And then decide. That’s what I’m doing. Seek the truth for yourself.
mars hill is sooo not a cult
Well, golly! That’s all the proof I need!
-
Apparently if ‘dozens’ of people all put this into writing it would be enough proof for you.
Hey, you use “it’s gotta be true since I read it in the Bible,” so what’s the problem now?
Sounds like a plan, man. I’ll trust in the authority of scripture, and you trust in the authority of Salon.com, Seattle Weekly, Chrisitanity Today, and Stuff magazine.
Why do you have a problem with people who have come to your church to see for themselves? That’s all these writers have done. In fact, they’ve done more than just go to a service, so they really have more of an idea of what Mars Hill was about. I thought that was what you wanted.
From the comments I’ve seen here, on LiveJournal and in other communities from church supporters, I have to ask: When you see how other people see you, who are you really trying to convince that Mars Hill really isn’t like that?
Ah very clever Adam. You really had me doubting my beliefs there for a minute. Phew that was close!
You’re right though:
If you walk into Mars Hill with the same preconceived biased on life and God -
http://archive.salon.com/mwt/feature/2001/09/14/atheist/index.html
Then you have no need to go. You made up your mind a long time ago. Just like Lauren did.
FULL DISCLOSURE: I work for Christianity Today International, in the Internet Research & Developments dept. and in the Media Relations dept. But, I’m commenting now as Michael Herman — not as a representative of CTI.
With that said…
It’s common to judge Christianity according to our impression of Christians, or of a few Christians we know, or against the worst of the bunch. Hey, it’s only human.
Fact is, while growing up in centrist evangelical Christian circles, I’ve watched the fringes of those who profess my faith and often cringe at what is called to be a thing from God. Christians are a messy bunch — and the best of us understand that and are saddened.
Looking at Mars Hill, in my opinion, it should be judged against the standards of the Bible. Every Christian should judge their own actions, thoughts, and words against Scripture if they wish to claim to be a Christian. Right?
Mars Hill is hit from all sides, daily. And the vast majority of the attacks come from Christians who don’t attend the church. Yes, just like the wind, we can see the effects it produces. And in studying a church, their fruits must be tested.
I’ve heard many times this saying (or a similar version of it), “In the essentials, unity. In the non-essentials, love.” I come back to this phrase whenever I’m frustrated with the way a church, or another Christian is choosing to go about their business in their faith. But surely others have looked at my life and thought similar things.
We are raised and influenced by such a strange and wonderful collection, an algorithm if you will, that produces who we are in our beliefs, and in our views of others not like us. That’s on purpose, and I thank God for that — despite the continual frustrations.
We are a bickering family. We are a zealous bunch. We are sure of our ideas — except in hindsight.
But thankfully, we will see everything clearly some day on the other side of this life. That promise gives me hope for us…for me.
Those are just some of my thoughts…perhaps some of them are relevant.
(pls. excuse any spelling errors. I raced through this in order to get my thoughts in here during my lunch break.)